Kingdom-Building: A Valois-Bourgogne TL

Should I create a smallish chapter dedicated to the normal life of Burgundy or the Burgundian Court?


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I hope Burgundy remains somewhat independent from the HRE, or at the very most a vassal state.
I envision that burgundy is in a similar position as Austria: as the head of a powerful bloc in the hre, which would allow it to eventually subsume them under the Burgundian crown as time goes on to fight against the Austrians (at first).
 
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Chapter 3: War of the Public Weal
"Louis XI of France only had two allies. The count of Charolais and the Duke of Milan that should speak to his genius in politics. He fought off English, Berry, Brittany, Bourbon, Lorraine, Nemours, Armagnac, Orleans, Albret, and Anjou. He fought them to a standstill then broke up the entire thing within a couple of years." -Paul Murray Kendall (He wrote about Louis the Spider. Great read y'all should read it)

February 21 1465, Paris, France
Louis was now deeply concerned with his affairs of state. Charles his brother, Duke of Berry was demanding the duchy of Normandy or Aquitaine. Brittany, Bourbon, Lorraine, Armagnac simply wished to expand, while Nemours wanted a seat in government. His centralization reforms were working but now he must crush the rebellious nobles and to solidify his kingdom. How lucky he was when he negotiated the marriage between Anne and Philip. Charles demanded the complete independence of Burgundy for his assistance in the upcoming war but he was brilliant and increased the dowry price in crowns. (400,000 crowns for the marriage) and a promise of land after the defeat of the rebellious nobles. Charles who was cautious in his negotiations decided to accept reasoning that he was more powerful than the King and could extract land confessions later. He also secured an alliance with Milan when the war was to come.

Charles, Duke of Berry was in Bourges talking to the various nobles he was hosting. "Gentlemen, good afternoon, as you all know 4 years ago in this city our glorious king. Charles VII passed away. My elder brother Louis XI seized the throne claiming his birthright. Gentlemen, I am here to dispute that with all of you. Your rights and privileges have been seized by this false king! My father, exiled Louis and banished him from court. HE HAS NO RIGHT TO CLAIM THE THRONE. I ASK ALL OF YOU TO FOLLOW ME, YOUR RIGHTFUL KING CHARLES VIII!" A cheer began amongst the nobility however, quickly they began to disperse and head back to their own lands.

A month afterwards, the French nobility called Louis XI an impostor and demanded he give up the throne to his brother Charles VIII. Louis XI by the betrothal contract called Charles, count of Charolais, Milan and his remaining loyal nobles and his royal army and went to war. The English, under Edward IV began to secretly fund Charles giving money and arms to him in order to see his victory. Louis began to march south in order to stop the southern nobles under John II of Bourbon or known as the Scourge of the English. Charles who was in Bruges when he heard the news began to gather his forces and march south. Philip and Isabella asked him not to lead his armies personally as they have been travelling between the two Burgundies for quite a while. "I must do what is necessary to save you idiotic godfather." He simply replied to Isabella's and Philip's pleading.

His army began to march towards Nancy and faced off against John II of Lorraine. Both of their armies divided in three, Charles leading the left flank ordered a mass charge towards the Lorrainian right. The astonishing speed of both the arrival and charge threw Lorraine off balance in the right flank as its subsequent collapse. The centre and left who were disoriented at the speed of the charge began to collapse and flee. John sued for peace shortly after, and Louis gave him nothing but forced him out of the war. Charles seeing this victory and got no compensation was angry and told his confidante, "He better give me Champagne for saving his arse."

Charles of Berry, hearing news of the lightning quick defeat of Lorraine marched north from Bourges and met Charles, at Chatres. Charles looked at the battlefield knew the conditions were not favourable for a fight. A couple hundred kilometres away lies the Breton armies, they were exhausted and he knew he could crush them just as he had done in Lorraine but to his front lies Charles' armies fresh and ready to fight. If they united his forces would lose by numbers. Stupid Louis he thought, how could he miss the armies of the leader. He slammed his fist on the table in front of the map in front of his generals. We crush Charles and capture him immediately. We must end this rebellion now.

The battle began to ensue as the veteran Burgundian/Royalist army slammed into Charles' center. The fighting was fierce as both Charles were in the meat of it. The fighting quickly devolved into an all out slaughter. As the rebels slowly gave in to the Burgundians, a horn sounded signalling the arrival of the Breton armies. Francis II seeing that the battle already started shouted, "WE SHALL PROTECT THE KING! CHARGE!" The bretons eagerly rushed towards the Burgundian right flank. The Burgundian's believed that due to the war cry it was Louis's armies. How wrong they were. The Burgundian/Royalist army collapsed and fled. Charles riding away with no guard and a sole horse northwards towards Paris.

In the south, Louis XI had much more success defeating John at Roanne and then decisively crushed the Armagnac's near Brive-la-Galliarde. His royalist army which he remarked, "If there was one thing my father did correctly, it was the institution of a standing royalist army." He eventually forced a peace in the south forcing armagnac to give up Fezensac and Bourbon to cede Beaujeu. He also forced royalist officers to help "govern" the remaining counties and duchies. This complete victory was turned sour when he received news of the battle of Chatres. Hearing the news he angrily stated, "What use do I have for a powerful duke who could do nothing except lose?" He returned to Paris in a couple of months and negotiated the treaty of Conflans in which Charles would acknowledge Louis as King, Charles would exchange Berry for Normandy and Alencon. Francis would regain the royalist possessions in Brittany finally, Anjou would be granted Touraine.

Louis XI of France smiled at Charles' anger as he realized the dowry that Anne would receive. "BEAUJEU?!? YOU WOULD HAND ME BEAUJEU AFTER ALL I HAVE DONE FOR YOU?!?" Charles yelled in anger. "Do not disrespect your king, I have already given the 400,000 crowns and you gain Beaujeu. You cost me Normandy, Brittany, Anjou, Touraine and Alencon. If I wasn't as nice I wouldn't have given you any land at all." Louis replied coldly with a smile that showed no warmth. "And I have given you Nemours and Lorraine. I saved Paris from you by defending it until your army arrived!" Charles replied in anger. "I set the dowry, Charles. Per the treaty of Arras and our promise in Brussels you are obliged to accept. If you do not I will revoke Ponthieu from you and all the lands you have gained under that treaty." Louis replied with an even deadlier voice signalling his guards in case Charles drew his sword. Charles seeing the writing on the wall signed off on the paper confirming Anne and Philip's engagement and setting the marriage in 1476. Charles asked immediately to leave and return to his county and Louis granted it but not without one final remark, "You are a count, Charles be grateful that I granted you another lordship." Before beckoning his hand and forcing him to leave.

Teaser: "Look grandma! You look so pretty in this picture. Did you really look like this?" Philip eagerly asked.
 
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Character Study #3:
Charles the Careful: So this is like Charles' big character development. This is essentially what if he survived Nancy IOTL. He's traumatized, humiliated and defeated in battle. I still have plans for him so he's not dying anytime soon. He's going to go through the wringer when I'm done with him.
Louis XI: I hope I did his spider character justice. He leaves Lorraine as a rival (albeit small) for Burgundy. Defeats the south completely giving him a new pillar of support while ensuring all of his rivals remain in the north west so they fight each other over control and he can swoop in and take it all. He also humiliates Charles and yes this is where I return to OTL and the rivalry between Charles and Louis starts.
Charles, Duke of Normandy and Count of Alencon now: Really big changes compared to OTL. I want him to be a new version of Charles the Bold. Yes he will live longer and I still have plans with him.
 
Ooh so this is going for a Burgundian kingdom ittl? That's quite interesting, I wonder how it'd fare considering that France is on one side and Germany the other...

I wonder if we'd set Burgundy still be part of the HRE for much longer ittl and be able to have influence and even conquer the smaller German states, and form the nucleus of a German empire in the north that could combat France.

And be able to colonise a few places with a big enough German population behind them.
If you have never heard the story of Ottokar II of Bohemia. You should brush up on it now heh.
 
Interesting start but you have messed a lot of things: Beaujeu is not at disposal of either Louis XI or Charles the Bold as it is a possession of John II, Duke of Bourbon. Anne of France is the eldest daughter of Louis XI and she is born the 3 April 1461, so she is four years younger than her future husband. At the birth of ATL Philip of Burgundy, Louis XI is still childless and his wife was not yet sixteen years old
 
Interesting start but you have messed a lot of things: Beaujeu is not at disposal of either Louis XI or Charles the Bold as it is a possession of John II, Duke of Bourbon. Anne of France is the eldest daughter of Louis XI and she is born the 3 April 1461, so she is four years younger than her future husband. At the birth of ATL Philip of Burgundy, Louis XI is still childless and his wife was not yet sixteen years old
True, that is true I'll fix it later but I did address the Beaujeu thing. Louis confiscated it in the war from Bourbon.
 
Charles the Careful: So this is like Charles' big character development. This is essentially what if he survived Nancy IOTL. He's traumatized, humiliated and defeated in battle. I still have plans for him so he's not dying anytime soon. He's going to go through the wringer when I'm done with him.
Louis XI: I hope I did his spider character justice. He leaves Lorraine as a rival (albeit small) for Burgundy. Defeats the south completely giving him a new pillar of support while ensuring all of his rivals remain in the north west so they fight each other over control and he can swoop in and take it all. He also humiliates Charles and yes this is where I return to OTL and the rivalry between Charles and Louis starts.
Charles, Duke of Normandy and Count of Alencon now: Really big changes compared to OTL. I want him to be a new version of Charles the Bold. Yes he will live longer and I still have plans with him.
I love it! Interesting character study.
 
Chapter 3.5 The Court of Philip the Good
"The court of Burgundy has always been extravagant ever since Philip the Bold became duke. It first was funded almost entirely by French finance but as we arrive towards the Era of the Three Dukes, it was funded by Burgundian money something the people are very proud of today." -Joseph Calmette (His books are a very good intro to the every Burgundian duke def worth a read if you are a Burgundian simp like me)

February 22 1461, Lille, Flanders

"And Perseus saved Andromeda with the Head of Medusa, he went to the King of A-ethio-pia, and asked for his daughter's hand in marriage, in which he was granted the hand. He then took Andromeda back to Serifos, where they would live happily ever after." Philip read to his mother. Isabella smiled brightly, "Look at you!" she squeezed Philip's cheeks. "You read it perfectly, my thunder." Isabella of Portugal walked in to this scene. Philip seeing her exclaimed, "Grandma!!!!" He looked at his mom asking to be let down from her lap, which she did. Philip rushed towards Isabella hugging her. "My sweet grandson, what has gotten you so excited to see me?" She replied as she scooped him up to return the hug. "Mom won't let me see you. I wanted to travel with you again." Philip replied with a frown. Isabella smiled, who knew her grandson would be such a joy in her life. She asked, "Well then, shall we go and explore?" Isabella asked. "Mom can we please?!?" Philip begged, Isabella smiled and took her son's hand. "Of course, let us go."

As Isabella showed her son around the village and the court there was one thing that Philip stopped to look. "Mom who is that?" Philip asked pointing to the portrait. Isabella was about to answer when she was interrupted, "That would be me, grandson." Philip the Good, entered in the room replying. "GRANDPAPA!" Philip rushed to his grandfather's side. Philip picked his grandson up just like his wife for a hug. "Why do you look so sad in the picture grandpapa?" Philip frowned, "I was smiling." Philip replied, "No, a smile is like this." Philip looked at his grandfather in the eyes and smiled with all of his teeth showing. Philip smiled at his grandson's happiness. "See now that's a smile!" Philip exclaimed pointing at his grandfather interrupting the latter's thoughts. "Your grandson is correct you know?" Isabella of Portugal replied smacking Philip's arm. Philip replied back with equal sarcasm, "Looks like he's got you wrapped around his finger, and it's our grandson." Isabella of Bourbon took her son back and continued showing the boy the portraits. Philip and Isabella continued their mocking quarrel until Philip exclaimed, "Look grandma! You look so pretty in this picture! Is that really you?!?" Isabella looked at the portrait of herself. She always thought of it as too extravagant but was glad that her grandson approved of her portrait.

"My thunder, would you like to look like your grandfather and grandmother?" Isabella asked, "Can I?" He asked his grandparents with puppy eyes. "Of course my grandson, you have earned it." Philip tried on a very similar look to his grandfather which fit him personally however he didn't have any jewelry on him which disappointed Philip the Good. "My grandson where is your necklace?" Philip frowned, "It was too big and I didn't like it." Philip bent down towards Philip's eye level. "Why is that?" he asked with genuine curiosity. "I think I should wear something simpler like dad." Philip replied pointing to his father's portrait. Philip looked at the portrait, his son only wearing the collar of the Golden Fleece because he didn't earn the fire steels yet. Charles was irritated that he couldn't wear it back then but now, Philip didn't want to? "Grandpapa can I wear that?"He asked breaking Philip's thoughts as his grandson pointed towards the necklace right beside Isabella's portrait. It was a simple albeit expensive cross. Philip decided to place it on his grandson's neck completing the look. Philip smiled beautifully, as all the members in the room wished that a portrait was drawn of that moment.

Teaser: It was in this sombre mood, that Charles, count of Charolais became Charles I, Duke of Burgundy.
 
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So this is a shorter chapter, (If y'all say this was longer than chapter 1 and 2 I'll tell y'all to shush)
I might release a chapter 4 soon and we'll be back with Charles the Careful very soon. It's time to crank his humiliation and sorrow to 11
 
So this is a shorter chapter, (If y'all say this was longer than chapter 1 and 2 I'll tell y'all to shush)
I might release a chapter 4 soon and we'll be back with Charles the Careful very soon. It's time to crank his humiliation and sorrow to 11
Let's brace ourselves then. Anne will make sure france will pay for it later.
 
Character Study #4
Isabella of Bourbon: I know I haven't shown much of a romance side between her and Charles, I wish I wrote a prequel about their love it would be fun, but I'm focusing rn on the relationship between her and her son. If you don't know the reason why her nickname for her son was my little thunder. Legend has it that Mary was born with a thunderclap so I thought that was a good nickname cause Philip is Mary at this point.
Isabella of Portugal: Yes, she is still in love with her husband right now, but as we can see she cherishes her grandson a lot more. She still has an important role to play especially considering the next couple of chapters that focus on Charles the Careful.
Philip the Good: His cold statesman persona has melted in front of his grandson. (I would as well tbh) We will definitely see him play a larger role soon after all, his son's world is going to collapse after 1465.
 
I should probably write regarding Anne? A Chapter 2.5 for Anne of Savoy and our future Anne of Beaujeu (I TOLD YOU FRENCH MEDIEVAL POLITICS MAKES IT STUPID EASY TO GIVE HER BEAUJEU XD)
 
Random plot ideas I have so far: (Opinions are completely welcome)
A second Valois-Burgundian Civil War. This time it's between Anne vs Charles. (That's right Charles Duke of Normandy)
Anne of Savoy, do we make her OTL or change her personality completely into someone like Isabeau of Bavaria?
Charles the Careful and Frederick III, how does the fact Philip existing change the plans to make Charles King?
Imperial relations with Burgundy, the only reason why Frederick changes his tune is because Mary exists if Mary doesn't exist he will view the Burgundians with hostility unless something happens.
Italian-Burgundian relations, Savoy and Burgundy are quite close in terms of friends. If the Italian wars occurs when the death of Valois-Anjou comes how does Burgundy respond?
Spanish/Burgundian relations, Burgundy had practically 0 relations with the Spanish but when the union begins will Spain view France as an ally or a rival?
English/Burgundian relations, does Charles begin his policy of anti-French relations?
Franco-Austrian relations, if France is weak and struggling to throw Burgundy off would it make sense for them to ally Austria?
Burgundian/Hansa/Danish relations, when Burgundy inevitably unites the Netherlands who would they support the Hansa or the Danes?
 
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