American Rugby

[CultBoy]

I'm working on an AH tentatively dubbed "Eagle Ascendant: The Tail Of The American Rugby Superpower" I'm currently writing and am looking for an intersting POD not the usual Roosevelt bans America football and X takes it place divergance.

The premise of the timeline is Rugby Union is the fourth sport in North America (and growing), about half as popular as American Football, Baseball & Basketball, at the expense of Ice Hockey, Soccer and other team sports.

Any ideas?

 

[Moglwi]

I'm working on an AH tentatively dubbed "Eagle Ascendant: The Tail Of The American Rugby Superpower" I'm currently writing and am looking for an intersting POD not the usual Roosevelt bans America football and X takes it place divergance.

The premise of the timeline is Rugby Union is the fourth sport in North America (and growing), about half as popular as American Football, Baseball & Basketball, at the expense of Ice Hockey, Soccer and other team sports.

Any ideas?

WW1 the US units are scattered into the French and British units and are exposed to Rugby and they enjoy the game and bring it back toi the US where it isplayed at West Point and in Garrisons it recives another boost in WW2 when it is used to help cement Commanwealth/US coopration with games in OZ, New Zealand, UK etc.

 

[CultBoy]

WW1 the US units are scattered into the French and British units and are exposed to Rugby and they enjoy the game and bring it back toi the US where it isplayed at West Point and in Garrisons it recives another boost in WW2 when it is used to help cement Commanwealth/US coopration with games in OZ, New Zealand, UK etc.

Intresting I might have to steal that idea. Any other ideas anyone?

 

[Thande]

Isn't rugby a bit too similar to American football for them both to be highly popular?

It'd be like both cricket and rounders being equally high-profile in the UK.

 

[CultBoy]

Isn't rugby a bit too similar to American football for them both to be highly popular?

It'd be like both cricket and rounders being equally high-profile in the UK.

Well Rugby/Soccer/American Football are all from the same sports family, and Rugby/Soccer exist with large scale popular support in many countries such as England and France.

I think it is possible for both to exist as major sports in America or at least one major and one large scale sport like American Football and Ice Hockey in the USA in OTL or Football and Rugby in OTL Britain.

Though I will admit the relationship is usually one sided as in England. Bloody round ballers, Andrex Premiership, Why can't we have a match of the day.....moan moan moan

 

[Aberblue]

I'm working on an AH tentatively dubbed "Eagle Ascendant: The Tail Of The American Rugby Superpower" I'm currently writing and am looking for an intersting POD not the usual Roosevelt bans America football and X takes it place divergance.

The premise of the timeline is Rugby Union is the fourth sport in North America (and growing), about half as popular as American Football, Baseball & Basketball, at the expense of Ice Hockey, Soccer and other team sports.

Any ideas?

Rugby is a dull, boring "sport" that would never catch on in the USA.

Show me a rugby field and I'll show you a waste of grass.

 

[HARRY]

Cecil Rhodes set up the Rhodes scholarships in an attempt to help unite the Anglosaxon people. Perhaps if he decided to extend it to a Rhodes Rugby Cup with teams from each of his so call Anglosaxon nations. Its not a long stretch as Rugby Union has a longer association with universities and colleges.

 

[CultBoy]

Rugby is a dull, boring "sport" that would never catch on in the USA.

Show me a rugby field and I'll show you a waste of grass.

Nice troll, move along nothing to see here.

 

[CultBoy]

Cecil Rhodes set up the Rhodes scholarships in an attempt to help unite the Anglosaxon people. Perhaps if he decided to extend it to a Rhodes Rugby Cup with teams from each of his so call Anglosaxon nations. Its not a long stretch as Rugby Union has a longer association with universities and colleges.

Interesting will have to look it up.

 

[OperationGreen]

Rugby Union frankly is a terrible sport. If you actually want Rugby to take off you better stick with League its far faster and exciting and thus more watchable. Its success in Australia is a sign of its potential. League is a lot more “Blue Collar” game and I think it could build a massive following if introduced correctly.

 

[Alexius]

Isn't rugby a bit too similar to American football for them both to be highly popular?

It'd be like both cricket and rounders being equally high-profile in the UK.

Look at Australia, with rugby and Aussie Rules...

A Rhodes Cup might be a good idea- perhaps better if it was for the best university team from the different countries.

I think the best idea, however, is for there to be a wave of Welsh immigration to the US. After all, the Welsh brought rugby to Argentina.
Something then has to happen for there to be a reason for all those Welsh people to emigrate. Any ideas?

 

[CultBoy]

Look at Australia, with rugby and Aussie Rules...

A Rhodes Cup might be a good idea- perhaps better if it was for the best university team from the different countries.

I think the best idea, however, is for there to be a wave of Welsh immigration to the US. After all, the Welsh brought rugby to Argentina.
Something then has to happen for there to be a reason for all those Welsh people to emigrate. Any ideas?

Interesting honestly hadn't even considered that idea, even though I know about the Welsh importance in Argentina Rugby history. Any ideas people? What events could cause lots of Welshmen to move to America cause I'm at a blank?

Already working on a Cecil Rhodes Collegiate Rugby Tournament in the AH, but I won't spoil anything for you

Rugby Union frankly is a terrible sport. If you actually want Rugby to take off you better stick with League its far faster and exciting and thus more watchable. Its success in Australia is a sign of its potential. League is a lot more “Blue Collar” game and I think it could build a massive following if introduced correctly.

Personel opinion aside (I play Union) I went with Union because its the code I know far far more about and I'd struggle with a League based AH. But I do agree League is more of a "Working Class/Blue Collar" game and would probably more easily crack the USA in modern times cause of its large Blue Coller and Poor populations, my only concern would be how League would become a major sport by now after the 1922 code split, when Union was already established in the American since the 1870's in the college/university system and among British immigrants.

 

[Aberblue]

What events could cause lots of Welshmen to move to America cause I'm at a blank?

To get away from the endless drivel about rugby union in the Western Mail?

 

[CultBoy]

To get away from the endless drivel about rugby union in the Western Mail?

What? I thought they put up with that to sing "You can stick your f*!£ing chariots up your arse!" to England fans every time Wales beats England?

 

[OperationGreen]

Personel opinion aside (I play Union) I went with Union because its the code I know far far more about and I'd struggle with a League based AH. But I do agree League is more of a "Working Class/Blue Collar" game and would probably more easily crack the USA in modern times cause of its large Blue Coller and Poor populations, my only concern would be how League would become a major sport by now after the 1922 code split, when Union was already established in the American since the 1870's in the college/university system and among British immigrants.

Well I am a League fan so lets agree to disagree.

Only thing I can think of would be WW2. There are lots of American GI's over in the UK for extended periods. Sport and competition are obviously promoted in the military especially in WW2 British Army to create closer units and organisation so it would be easy to start such trend. A British unit challenges the Americans etc each allied nation could have a small team. After the war the GI’s could bring it back and if it’s a major hit with them it’s got a shot of making it big. If people want it especially in America the TV will give it coverage and encouragement.

Honestly and for me this is my personal opinion. Union seems to get broken up very often for Penalties etc hardly any open play. When watching American Football that also is not exactly fast paced. There may be a brief moment and then it all calms down against as they reorganise so I don’t think it’s a stretch for any Rugby to get a foothold however the problem Union has over League is that its seen as a rather Establishment sport which may not be able to get people excited if they see Prince Charles playing it etc…

 

[noleman]

Another suggestion is if you can keep rugby as an olympic sport, that'd encourage play in the USA. It was stopped in the 1924 summer games.

 

[Seldrin]

Rugby is a dull, boring "sport" that would never catch on in the USA.

Show me a rugby field and I'll show you a waste of grass.

Rugby Union frankly is a terrible sport. If you actually want Rugby to take off you better stick with League its far faster and exciting and thus more watchable. Its success in Australia is a sign of its potential. League is a lot more “Blue Collar” game and I think it could build a massive following if introduced correctly.

, Like I've said so many times before, playing rugby is so good, its like having sex.

 

[CultBoy]

Just thought I would post I small preview, firstly a stat sheet for my alternate Eagles I've worked out from the basic TL I have at the moment.

United States Of America Team Stats

Union: USARugby
Nickname: The Eagles
Home Stadium: The New Eagles Nest, New York (75,000 Capacity)
Emblem: Bald Eagle
Coach: William Macy (USA)
Most Caps: Scott Caddock (Outside Centre) 208 Caps
Most Scored: Jeremiah “Jerry” Simpson (Fly Half) 985 Points
Most Tries: Dan “The Man Mountain” Davis (Winger) 65 Tries

Home Kit: Navy Blue Shirt, White Socks & Shorts
Away Kit: Blood Red Shirt, White Socks & Shorts
Largest Win: America vs. Spain 126-3 (1996)
Worst Defeat: New Zealand vs. America 88-6 (1954)
World Cup Appearances: 1972, 1976, 1980, 1984, 1988, 1992, 1996, 2000, 2004, 2008
World Cup Wins: 1980, 1988 & 1996
Other Trophy Wins:
North American Cup 1964-81, 1983-88, 1990-92, 1995, 1997-2000, 2002, 2004, 2005-07 & 2009-10
Olympic Medals 1920 Gold, 1924 Gold, 1928 Gold, 1932 Gold, 1936 Gold, 1968 Bronze, 1972 Silver, 1976 Gold, 1984 Silver, 1992 Gold, 1996, Gold, 2000 Gold, 2004 Gold & 2008 Bronze

And also the 2011 line up of the two national leagues and the four top regional leagues (In the AH America is divided into four regions with the advent of a pro national league, though European style relagation & promotion will still occur making Pro Rugby different from the other major US sports).

I got the team names from real American rugby clubs and some I made up, suggest better names/places for clubs if you can think of some. Note my US geography isn't fantatsic when it comes to exact city locations, so if you think a team would be more realistic in another regional league just say.

US Domestic League Stats

National Super League Line Up 2011
Las Vegas Blackjacks
New York Old Blue
San Francisco RFC
Long Beach RFC
Chicago Lions
Boston Irish
Chicago Irish
Santa Monica RFC
Miami RFC
Boston Wolfhounds
Rockford Ravens
Dallas RFC

National League One Line Up 2011
Seattle RFC
Batton Rouge RFC
New Orleans RFC
New York Manhattan
Philadelphia RFC
Atlanta Aces RFC
Puget Sound RFC
Newport RFC
New York Athletics Club
Aspen RFC
Washington RFC
Little Rock RFC

Central League One 2011
Southside RFC
Chicago Scarlet
Indianapolis RFC
Fort Wayne RFC
Des Moines RFC
Cedar Rapids Headhunters
River City RFC
Iowa City Ducks
Michigan RFC
Old Oakland RFC
Minneapolis Mayhem

Eastern League One 2011
Buffalo Bulls
Springfield RFC
Albany RFC
Hartford RFC
Long Island RFC
Southern New York RFC
New Jersey RFC
Baltimore Barons
Baltimore RFC
Quantico Veterans
Pittsburgh Athletic
Norfolk Mariners

Southern League One 2011
Memphis Jazz
Knoxville RFC
Nashville Outlaws
Nashville Grizzlies
Atlanta Renegades
Collier Heights RFC
Naples RFC
Naples Italian
Tampa Bay RFC
Daytona Beach RFC
Panama City Sharks
San Antonio RFC

Western League One 2011
Tacoma RFC
The Valley RFC
Portland Old Guard RFC
Carson Cowboys RFC
Phoenix RFC
L.A Exiles RFC
Los Angeles RFC
Henderson Welsh
San Diego Gladiators
Orange County Gators
Yuma RFC
San Jose Athletic

 

[Kevin in Indy]

I got the team names from real American rugby clubs and some I made up, suggest better names/places for clubs if you can think of some. Note my US geography isn't fantatsic when it comes to exact city locations, so if you think a team would be more realistic in another regional league just say.

Of the two Indianapolis clubs, I'd use the name Impalas for the Central League One franchise. There is another club here in town (in fact, my son's U19 tends to feed into it), but the club name "White River Fishkill" doesn't quite ring the same.

Ravens must have a stunning club history. The city of Rockford, Illinois is on the fringe of the Chicago metro area (when I lived there, we resented being called a "Chicago suburb") and is the smallest of the Super League cities listed. Might be fun to write a history for the club which parallels that of the Green Bay NFL franchise.

 

[Kevin in Indy]

Possible PoDs which may help promote Rugby in the United States -

• Get some publicity from Samuel Clemens. He had pretty much settled in the East by the time Rugby was ascendent in California, but perhaps on a trip to San Francisco he took to writing about the sport. It wouldn't necessarily have to be complimentary - as they say, any publicity is good publicity.
• Some additional matches between the eastern (Yale / Harvard / Columbia / Princeton) and western (Stanford / Cal) clubs prior to Roosevelt's intervention (1906) might have steered the rules more toward Rugby and away from American Football
• Have some additional teams play in the Olympics in 1920 and 1924, causing the IOC to continue the sport