If the Plymouth Pilgrims managed to reach the Hudson River Delta area in present-day New York and settled there, Manhattan Island in particular, is there a possibility that the concept of a "New Netherland" would be materialized? What would be the Pilgrims' relationship with the Iroquoian tribes?
A simple question related to Plymouth Pilgrims
- Thread starter ramones1986
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First, it should be noted that the Dutch built their first fort at roughly modern Albany several years before the Pilgrims landed at Plymouth.
And second, just because there are English where the Dutch settled historically doesn't mean that the Dutch aren't going to settle anywhere. The Dutch also historically surveyed and considered the Delaware valley (Philadelphia is on the Delaware, and it defines most of the New Jersey-Pennsylvania border, to give you a sense of location).
Third, it's interesting to think what might happen if the Pilgrims land at Manhattan after the Dutch had already. There are a three main options that I see: the first, and least likely, is that the Dutch contest the landing, the British back it, and the two go to conflict or some uneasy situation with the Pilgrims at the mouth of the Hudson and the Dutch in the valley. The second is that the Dutch complain and the British, who already don't enormously like the Pilgrims, point out that the settlement is illegal anyway because their charter was for the Chesapeake area, and remove them. The third, and somewhat interesting, is that the Pilgrims decide to defect to the Dutch - which is less unlikely than it sounds. The Dutch Reformed Church is much more similar to Pilgrim beliefs than the Church of England, and the Dutch were already well known for their religious tolerance. Plus, the Pilgrims had already spent a long period in the Netherlands themselves, and actually some proposals for the Pilgrim colony had been in Dutch-controlled territory (notably what is now Guyana)
As to the Iroquois...
The immediate region of Manhattan is actually mostly Lenape, not Iroquois. The Iroquois are actually kinda far away, all the up the Hudson, and so it's hard to judge interactions because by the time they happen, the colony will already be quite well developed with its own legacy of dealings with whatever locals there are.
Hmmmm.... Considering the different scenarios that you gave, it's quite clear that there still be "New Netherland" in Manhattan, Hudson Valley and present-day New Jersey without renaming it as such, with English-speaking Pilgrims as the majority.